Can someone please explain to me how their goal wasn't offside?

Their player (can't remember who) was miles offside, came back, interfered with play, and then ends up with the ball and netted it home.

The initial play affected the outcome? His initial offside surely calls the goal back?

I'm not too disappointed. I thought we played with a ton of effort. First half was very good. Second bang average and we were punished. But I'd ask again to someone who might know the rules better than I, how was the initial offside which clearly affected the play not be called?

Agree Jamie with all you've written. Diaz may not have 'attempted to play the ball' but by being in an offside position his team gained a huge advantage in that Tarkowski had to make an awkward lunge instead of just being able to punt the ball cleanly away! Really gets my goat and typical that it's that lot that gain advantage of that 'loophole' in the law or poor application thereof.

As to the game I'm not disheartened and agree with your summary.

It always hurts to get beaten by that lot but we've seen they don't like the physicality and add a bit more quality in attack and we'll hopefully under Moyes start to lay to rest some ghosts.

Not an easy job to keep the steel while adding some silk but we can at least start looking up.

Tough run of games but play like this and with better finishing we'll hopefully get mathematically safe.

Jamie I agree 100/%.
the positioning of the offside Player, in question, Can also distract our goalkeeper and provoke general pandemonium.

Although, we can’t compensate for the consistently amateurish performances, of Harrison and very often Doucore.
I personally thought that Alcaraz and Doucore ‘s roles should have been reversed.
I thought Alcaraz had too far to run, and could have better linked up with Beto, in a more advanced Role.

Doucore often needs more than one touch and his passing, for want of a better word, is.. Shite!
All that said, what an irksome litlle Tit, that Jota is.

Lyndon, you said about Moyes taking notes I had a few of my own!
Pickford - Thought he was back to his erratic ways. Struggled on the corners and was fortunate a foul had already been given when he took Nunez out.
O’Brien - worst game at right back and struggled with Diaz. Seemed to lack confidence
Mykolenko - had Salah in his pocket
Harrison - awful game. Not sure he found a blue shirt or decent cross all night
Doucoure - does ok off the ball chasing, closing down etc but when in possession no positive contribution
Beto - shows again he is a one trick pony. Willing runner for the through ball, and dangerous finishing in those situations, but poor in the air, can’t hold the ball and bring others into the game
N’diaye - I’m not convinced he is fit. Heavy strapping on his leg and barely touched the ball in the 25 minutes he was on

There are a lot of questions being asked by the Media this morning, as to why Tarks wasn’t sent of, for that tackle on one of their Darlings.

But, not many questions, as to why their goal wasn’t ruled out, for offside.

This is glaring Bias.

I live in hope, that in the not to distant future, we can smear it all over their Faces!

whoops ! I’m starting to Sound like Kevin Keegan!

Paul Conway -

I fear Alcaraz will become the "Leon Osman" of this Moyes tenure.

What I mean by that is simply a player played out of position constantly. Osman was a center mid. I thought the guy had sublime technical ability and was a natural central midfielder. My recollection was that Moyes constantly played him out wide, where I thought most of his talent was absolutely wasted.

Alcaraz should play behind the striker. He's an attacking player, and he's wasted, in my opinion, in another position.

I'm hoping Duke leaves the club soon - and I wish him no ill will, he hustles, he kept us up with his goal a few years ago for crying out loud - and Alcaraz slots in where he belongs, at the 10.

John Chambers -

Myko was marvelous yesterday. Salah did nothing. Salah, although a red, is a joy to watch play football. He's amazing.

Last night he did nothing. Myko just took him out of the game completely.

Paul (5), the thing about the Tarkowski incident is it wasn’t a tackle, it was a pass… or at least a clearance in Beto’s direction. That’s why he kicked it with such power and why his foot was in that open position that looks so awful on freeze frame. Yes, there was a lot of force involved and I guess I can see why some think it was a red… but In my opinion I think the fact people keep calling it a ‘tackle’ or a ‘challenge’ is half the problem here.

I agree with Duncan. It was a clearance, the RS was attempting to block the clearance. Nothing to see here.

Full disclosure: it was a very bad challenge and we couldn’t have had any complaints had he seen red for it.

Tarkowski does have previous for this type of thing, having almost put Richardson into orbit via the Paddock while playing for Burnley at Goodison a few years back. Naturally, we were all fuming at the time……

What I find interesting is the way that this has now turned into a witch hunt, with seemingly every pundit out there trying to outdo the others in their condemnation. I remember Gerrard’s so-called tackle on Gary Naismith and Dirk ‘nice guy’ Kult’s assault on Phil Neville around the same time. I don’t recall there being anything like this level of vitriol over either of them, despite there being, if anything, much more malice aforethought on both of those occasions.

Most TV outlets are infested with ex-LFC players, and with plenty of fanboys amongst the Fourth Estate also, there will always be a one-way shrill chorus.

As a result, then should Tarkowski so much as cough close to one of theirs in the next Derby, then he might well be sent off. I hope Moyes is alive to the possibility and may detect a small but significant ‘injury’ to keep him out the firing line. Better than playing them a man short.

Tony Killen 10

This nauseating Bias has been going on for Decades.

If it’s not the Media, it’s referees who try to nobble us.

The following is a Quote from Howard Kendall, after the 3-1 loss to them:

«  We hadn’t really looked in any danger, we were dictating the game.

but defensively you cannot do the things we did and get away with it, because a team like Liverpool Will punish you. »

As for the «  blatant penalty » for Nichol’s first - half challenge on Sharp ?

«  From where I was sitting Sharp had a free header and for him not to touch it there must have been an infringement.

I believe my opinion will be proved right when I see if again, just as it was two years ago in the Milk Cup Final when Hansen handled. It was the same referee, too.

So we could have gone in at half - time 2-0 ahead.

I know it’s going to sound like sour grapes, but incidents like that are turning points and I can’t help but mention it.

Et Voila! And I’m sure it will continue into the far Distant Future.

Forgot to mention, that those quotes were immediately after the 1986 FA Cup Final loss to them.

The Premier League is unforgiving. Having been able to talk up a nine game unbeaten run our narrative may now switch to five games without a win or only one win in eight matches in all competitions. We have also failed to keep a clean sheet in those eight matches.

Once again the limitations of our players, all of whom are willing and honest individuals, were brutally exposed against a team with much higher quality albeit not firing on all cylinders. The counter attacking tactics adopted last night were our only hope of obtaining anything from the game. Unfortunately we were too frequently let down by terrible passing.

With a further four very tough fixtures this month the manager needs to find a way of making the defence watertight while making more effective use of the ball on the counter. It is a familiar dilemma with which all of our recent managers have wrestled.

I’d love to see some of you guys playing football. You end up on your arses every time you kick the ball?
Tarkowski went into an 80/ 20 contest (in his favour) as if it were a 50/ 50. There was miles too much (completely unnecessary) forwards momentum and follow-through. And he’s got ‘previous' as Tony Killen has pointed out.
Jamie C, it’s not an uncommon call for an offside player to be judged to be ‘not interfering with play’ if they don’t actually try to compete for the ball. Often suspect but not uncommon.
Leon Osman had bags of skill / technique but lacked the requisite physicality to be a truly competitive centre mid. No pace, little strength equals not a world beater.

Good to see you here Si, but I am taking Jamie's side on that call. My reason is the pass that Tark went to ground to block was intended for Diaz and therefore he affected play from an offside position. No other Red was running to that channel, Diaz was the obvious target.

I clearly agree with Dale. And Dale's summary of this is better, much better, than mine.

Si -

Regarding the Tark tackle, I was the first to say on the Live Forum over at TW that Tarks knew EXACTLY what he was doing. It was, most definitely, a nasty challenge. He followed through hard as heck, and knew damn well he was getting a piece of that leg. But...

It's a derby, and I thought, and said on the Live Forum, it's a strong yellow. It's not a red. And frankly, the yellow is the right call. He was like two feet away with the initial challenge, and the subsequent contact was vicious, but not such that was a leg-breaker red.

Shithousery by Tarks? I'd argue yes. To the level of expulsion, twelve mintues into a derby? No. To the level in any other game? No again. Which is why you never ruin a derby if you're a referee for that challenge.

Osman was lightweight on the ball a bit, I'll give you that. But he was never meant to play outside, which he did very often under Moyes. Osman was silk on a ball in my opinion. I personally would have taken him every day in midfield, even if he did get brushed off a ball 2-3 times a game. His vision and ability were wonderful. I always thought he was one of the most underrated players in my time watching, as he never could play to his strengths played out wide. And every time I watched him in the middle of the pitch, his positives always outweighed his negatives.

I hope Moyes sees Alcaraz is a 10 and plays him there.

It goes without saying but I will say (state) it anyway, good to see you here as well Jamie.

Thanks, Dale. You, too.

UTFT